Tuesday, January 24, 2012

"Yes Man"

I've decided this posting wasn't fair.
To second a motion for discussion doesn't approve of the ultimate goal of a resolution or idea being put forth, it simply opens up discussion.
I'll admit when I'm not being fair, and I apologize to Dave Henderson.

--later

Well, now people in the know are informing me that a council member should only second if one is in agreement with a motion, and since you didn't know enough to agree with the motion, Dave, you really were not being honest, but rather overly obsequious to the mayor.

I guess we all have a lot to learn.

And as for you saying this blog is a witch hunt, I would say, I have a right to speak the truth about a mayor who, in the two years before winning the office, was a rude, spiteful and dishonest member of the community who did her best to insult, belittle and accuse council members and staff for things they DID NOT DO.

At least I write the truth.

It is said I smear the mayor. But if by quoting her I am smearing her... well, I guess that means she is smearing herself.



28 comments:

  1. That's funny, I might be the only council person that actually read all the resume's and sent a note to the city manager with questions about appointments this morning (some didn't even know they were posted on the agenda page). Did it ever dawn on you that I really like Gordon, and think he'd be a great committee person?

    Dave

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  2. Oh yeah, and sometimes you just second something to get the conversation started. I have done that in the past and really appreciated a second by another councilperson so we could get something on the table. It's called common courtesy.

    Dave

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  3. What a nightmare, Daniels has not even been chastened by her bad press, there she is trying to sneak a well-known TCUer (Schepke) and 2 unknowns into the nomination for planning commission. This smacks of special interests and closed door plotting on her and her followers's part.

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  4. I'm not sure I'd be admitting in public that you like a man who got up and insulted every Troy resident of Asian background by calling them "Chi-Coms" while he was slamming on the Transit Center.

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  5. If you had read everyone's resume and knew exactly who she was talking about, why did you have to ask for their names Dave? Does your neck ever get sore from Madam Mayor pulling on your leash?

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  6. Point taken, but I know Mr. Schepky pretty well and he's a passionate Troy neighbor frustrated like many (including Sue or Sharon), and he was raised in a different era than you and I (I assume). What infuriates me is the way the ink wasn't even dry on the minutes of tonights meeting and look at the headlines above. It's again common courtesy to second a motion by a councilperson (we are a team even if we have different opinions), if for no other reason than to bring an idea to the table for discussion. I offer the same courtesy to Ms. McGuiness or Mr. Slater with whom I am not presumed to be a yes man for, or share a lot of common ideas. Until the editors of this blog space stop looking under every rock for nuggets to pull an "I gotcha" out, the city will never bridge the divide. This was a silly initial post meant for one reason only, and we know what that is.

    Dave

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  7. If you watched the meeting it was made clear the two names other than Gordons that the Mayor threw out there were not submitted until yesterday morning. I don't wait until the morning of the meeting to do all my prep for a Monday meeting. Those two names were not on the roster when I was doing research this weekend, Gordons was. Once again, sometimes you second another council persons idea simply to get it on the table for further discussion. This is preferable to simply ignoring an individual that you work with. Kind of a witch hunt, this blog IMHO, and a silly one at that.

    Dave

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  8. Dave - The issue many had was that Mr. Schepky (sic) is well-known to Council watchers for rather highly opinionated and a one-sided perspective- hardly the desirable attributes of a Planning Commission member charged with the best interests of the City. While the Mayor was certainly in her rights to nominate anyone, what struck us was once again the perception that she is trying once again to run roughshod over the Council and City Staff. So, it becomes the perception of an abuse of power. Interesting that no one knows anything about the background of the other two - so "subject to the approval" connotes an informed choice.

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  9. 1. I presume that the post was meant to point out what a Mayor's lapdog you are. If this particular incident doesn't support that position, there have been a myriad of examples in the recent past to paint you as a patsy.

    2. I've watched a lot of council meetings and I don't believe it has ever been necessary to second a motion before somebody questions what it's all about. I have seen plenty of motions clarified before anyone seconds it.

    3. Since you know him so well what is Mr. Schepky, or the other two last minute nominations, so frustrated about that can be addressed by putting him on something as important as the planning committee? I think that before he is voted on, maybe we should hear some of his grievances and how he plans to remedy them with a planning committee placement. What kind of new ideas are needed on this committee that the Mayor feels compelled to replace people who wish to continue to serve the city?

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  10. Dave, you need to start reading the tea leaves a little better. Being with Janice on anything is putting you on a pain train to disaster. Everything she does now is suspect and open to heavy scrutiny. She has proved herself to have the judgment of a five year old and no common sense whatsoever, proved not just by her loony assertions of facts where none are present and supported by the nut jobs she pulls in to support her positions. This rubs off on you, Doug. Why is this so hard to understand? You see the people who come to the podium to support her...a large percentage act like they're off their meds, week after week. Extremism is neither politically smart or attractive to the majority of people, and the spotlight is on.

    You seem like a nice guy. Do yourself a favor and step away from her stupidity before she takes you down with her.

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  11. Come on Dave, look at previous council video. Janice Daniels and everyone from TCU (DeBacker, Berk, et. al.) were never respectful of the mayor, council or other citizens, save their own, trying to do something in this community. Daniels consistently made inflammatory remarks to down right lies unabashedly.
    It is great that all the new council members and (hopefully some day) the mayor will understand and get in the groove of parliamentary rules and law, so I agree about the seconding of a motion.
    But with regards to looking for a "gotcha" from this blog, that is way off base. JD and TCU are masters of the gotcha (remember the false perks and pleasures lies) and this blog is finally shining a big light on behavior that has gone on long enough.
    If JD and TCU can exercise their right to "redress their grievances," as they did, then the mayor and the rest, must respect and accept that others have the same right. I am sure it doesn't feel good being on the receiving end of some unhappy residents. TCU thought they could get away with some frankly heinous politic behavior and felt self-rightous doing so. But it is EXACTLY that behavior that created the ugly climate that you are now experiencing first hand in Troy. They are why this blog even exists.

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  12. Thanks Sharon, very fair. I never claimed to have seen the other two resume's or names. Thats why I asked for them and the spelling. As I said, I did my homework on this particular item on Sunday... the names weren't there until Monday sometime during the day according to Aileen Bitner... while I was doing my actual job.

    Whether your readers choose to believe it or not, I'm no ones "lap dog", just doing my best to dissect each item as it comes along. As I've learned by fire... that is far more difficult than it might seem from a civilians perspective.

    As far as this being an attempt by the Mayor to run rough shod... I've seen this occur in the past under other councils. Another member places additional names in the running for committee positions. She didn't replace the names already there, she added to the list. We all get one vote, if there are more nominees than positions available, the vote is asked for and we each disclose who we want on the committee. It's a very fair system. Mr. Tietz added one to the election committee last night that went unnoticed, was he trying to run rough shod over the council?

    Again thanks Sharon, I appreciate the thought and the olive branch. (even if I did have to stick my neck out to get it :0))

    Dave

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  13. Dave: I would never second anything in a meeting for the purpose of being polite. That is because I take what I do seriously and I understand that my actions have ramifications. So to second something to be polite just cements my impression of you. I don't believe you or Janice have the credentials or experience to be in the positions you are in. It is seriously scary stuff to watch you two in action. You both seem clueless and you reinforce that at every meeting. Your posts here further indicate that you do not understand what is happening in our community - we have a mayor who is poison and she is poisoning herself. She doesn't need help. Pointing it out is not a witch hunt, it's factual reporting. People who behave badly hate having it pointed out.

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  14. I spoke with the city manager earlier today and this topic (seconds to motions) came up. His suggestion was for me to "second the motion for discussion". Yes we all have a lot to learn. The funny thing about our government is that if you want to get involved and run for office you can, and the only thing that qualifies you in most cases is being a citizen, and your ability or willingness to raise funds and hit the ground campaigning. Isn't America a great country?

    The question is, do you want career politicians that hang in there for 12 years and have their meeting skills polished to such a degree as to never make a mistake at a meeting, or do you want passionate well intentioned citizens that have to learn protocol and systems to function without so much scrutiny.

    Call me what you like, but simply stating what you stated in this initial blog no more accurately defines me or what I am about than many of the other things you've thrown my way. Again, I appreciate the olive branch, why do you have to muddy that?

    I promise you one thing, by the end of 4 years not one of your readers will be calling me a lap dog, a rubber stamper or a yes man for anyone. I'm truly surprised that you haven't figured that out by now. I think you have, this is just the only thing you can think of to cloud the image of an otherwise nice guy, family man, and advocate for the taxpayers in Troy.

    Dave

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  15. There is no excuse for racism, Dave, none, including age. We should all keep learning until we die, and if we don't, well then we shouldn't be put on committees. You do a disservice to all those the same age as Gordon. Many of them grew up with racism and bigotry and have learned a better way. Shame on you for excusing it.

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  16. I guess my parliamentary question is: was this even a Resolution? I saw it as simply Nominations, which, under Robert's, do not require a Second, unless there are Council Procedures in place that supersede Robert's

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  17. According to Robert's Rules, "As a general rule, with the exceptions given below, every motion should be seconded. This is to prevent time being consumed in considering a question that only one person favors..." One of the exceptions cited is motions for nominations.

    So it seems that Dave is wrong on two accounts. First, motions involving nominations do not require a second. Second, if he didn't agree with the Mayor's motion as stated, he shouldn't have seconded it to prevent time being wasted on a motion that nobody was going to approve.

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  18. This is why I come to this blog everyday; I see real and honest discussions about what is good for our community.

    If Daniels feels she is too heavily scrutinized, she has only herself to blame. She would never recognize this as her fault because she is so out of touch with reality. However, to see Sharon apologize for her error in judgement is an example of an honest discussion.

    Daniels knows nothing about respecting people who do not share her opinion and so she has to undermine others to get her way.

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  19. Ruh Roh

    Troy mayor, city manager argue about transit center, mail

    www.dailytribune.com/articles/2012/01/24/news/doc4f1ea8f04da21510390241.txt


    FROM THE OFFICE OF THE CITY MANAGER

    January 16, 2012

    To: Janice Daniels, Mayor
    From: John Szerlag, City Manager
    Subject: Response to your January 7, 2012 Position Paper Entitled “Troy Multi-Modal TransitCenter”

    Your above reference position paper, which contains many more topics than the transit center, is filled with inaccuracies and has damaged my reputation. As such, I am compelled to respond.

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  20. I'm done playing on this one. My only objection was the notion on which sharon first wrote, and she retracted it and apologized. I accepted and truly appreciate the gesture.

    Do I have a lot to learn about procedure, yes. This was the first time we had nominees for committees on the agenda. I asked appropriate questions of city staff before the meeting, they answered respectfully, but still a situation arose that was not in my area of expertise. Unafraid of doing things, and not wanting to drop the ball, I backed up a colleague and we were able to discuss a matter. I don't see anything wrong or outrageous with that.

    Some of you do, but I suspect there's little I can do to please. That's my cross to carry, I can take it. See you at the next meeting.

    Dave

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  21. http://www.dailytribune.com/articles/2012/01/24/news/doc4f1ea8f04da21510390241.txt

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  22. Dave, if you "know Mr. Schepky pretty well", how is it that you don't know that his last name is actually Schepke.

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  23. The editors of this blog don't have to "look under every rock for nuggets to pull an "I gotcha" out." Those moments occur week after week (sometimes day after day) with this mayor.

    She is an embarrassment to this city. So much so that even my conservative in-laws are planning on participating in a recall effort.

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  24. On the spelling (and then I'm out of this one). It's my fault for getting a little lazy on the spelling. In my haste to respond to this post, I probably should have looked it up before posting to be accurate. I did however just check my phone to verify the spelling... I have him in there as Gordon. I'll add his last name so I can quickly reference it when I need to in the future.

    Overall not a bad day when you can take a post like this had begun and reduce it to Daves a bad speller :0)

    Dave

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    Replies
    1. Overall not a bad day when you can take a post like this had begun and reduce it to Daves a bad speller :0)"


      You can call it a win if you like. <:-0 Charlie Sheen is a winner too, if one asks him.

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  25. Um, Dave, if "you can only call me a bad speller" is all you got out of this message thread, then heaven help the citizens of Troy.

    Among other things, even your critics are telling you that it doesn't help your public image to be supportive of someone who has made flagrantly racist comments on public record. There is NO excuse for racism and there is no reason that a public official, such as yourself, should gloss over it. Period. For your own sake, Dave, please reflect on that.

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  26. Dave I think I know why you say after 4 years no one will say your a yes man! Janice will not be there for you to say yes to!

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